Conversation - part 9

How can we build understanding with those who profoundly disagree with us?

Be sure to read the previous posts on this topic from January 2022 to get the full story...

So, here we are at the end of the conversation. I hope it has challenged you to think at least half as much as it challenged me. I believe that it was valuable for Derek on several levels as well and, although he did not respond to me again, it seems that we reached some degree of understanding and relationship. The point of conversations is certainly to point to truth but this is difficult to do without also making a priority of building relationship and communicating the value of the other person in the process. We don't have to agree with their perspectives but we do have to demonstrate humility and compassion. I must realize that I don't have all the answers but I must be relentless in my search for truth and faithful confidence in God and His Word as the ultimate source of truth. 

My response was posted near the end of March 2020, at the beginning of a global pandemic, and is mainly focussed on the concepts of human value and purpose. Looking back, it seems it was an appropriate topic and was important for my own processing of events in my life! Do you think that I may have been a bit hard on Derek at certain points in this post? How could I have been more compassionate and humble while still communicating truth? Could I have more clearly pointed him to the love of Jesus and the purpose He calls us to?

My final response:

Hi Derek. Obviously it has taken me a while to respond this time for many reasons. Our world situation is quite volatile and my personal situation has not helped either: processing the death of my dad, moving back temporarily to the US, continuing work and helping my boys with online school, etc. But some response in our discussion is better than none, so I’ll add a few ideas here. Thanks for your patience and I really hope you are doing well physically and emotionally (and even spiritually!) during these challenging days!

I would begin from the other end of the spectrum with “once you begin to study and understand the ‘spiritual’, you realize that there is really something there.” But this must be qualified because we need to understand our terms, as you so wisely point out. I will not address the ‘paranormal’ here as that is a separate discussion and a tiny sub-point of the concept of ‘spiritual’.

You made some good points about purpose: Why should we be so selfish to think we have importance on a cosmic scale? What exactly is a spirit? Morality is part of our humanity/history and does not ‘require’ religion. You even agree that your personal morality recognizes the value of treating others with respect and empathy (even if it makes no difference in the bigger picture of life).

Yes. Fine. I can personally be satisfied with these answers if I was only concerned about myself and our friendly conversation. The problem is that I’m always driven to look at the bigger picture to think of the consequences of these ideas.

Here are a couple concepts that connect respect, hope and meaning to the bigger ideas of human value (and possibly help to define ‘spirit’).

How do we determine human value? It must be calculated by something. If it is physical, racial, ancestral, skills or knowledge (capacity or usefulness), power, wealth, relational value or something else, then that is one thing - but it gives everyone a different value. Those who are more valuable then have the right to discard or discredit those who are less valuable. If human value is a moral or a spiritual reality, that is entirely a different matter and gives meaning to the Universal Declaration of Human Rights (1948) which is founded in the biblical concept of “imago dei”.

If we look at fairly recent history, American slavery is a prime example of the horrific misinterpretation of spiritual value of the individual as well as an affirmation of biblical truth on this topic. It’s interesting that many slaves accepted and embraced Christianity for the hope and assurance of a God who loved them and demanded justice in spite of the abuses and outright lies of supposedly “Christian” slave owners. The work of Harriet Beacher Stowe, William Wilberforce, Harriet Tubman and many others show the power of biblical truth in the fight for justice and human rights simply because human value does NOT depend on utilitarian concepts or physical properties but spiritual value. How am I caring for those around me that are not valued by their community or society?

Nietzsche says that “compassion is weakness and nothing is more unhealthy than Christian compassion.” This is revolting. I have heard secular educational leaders in Romania note that the true definition of tolerance is Christian love. Christianity, specifically followers of Jesus, must engage in the work of serving the outcast and the powerless.

Comment: We don't serve the outcast because they are more valuable or morally superior, but because it is simply obedience to God, exercising care and stewardship in love to those who need it. This is called "charity".

We just watched the movie Harriet in early March. Maybe you saw something different, but we were amazed by the radical contrast between the value her “owner “ gave to her and her real value both as a person and as a recipient of love and grace that she could pass on to others. Even in the face of devastating loss, when she finds her husband is lost to her, her value does not change.

Is there anything else in the universe that determines its own meaning or its own value? Does a chair determine its meaning or value? Does an idea or a dog or a potato or a business or a currency determine its own value? So how can I determine my own meaning or value? What differences would make me able to do that?

So when you note that it is selfish to assume humans have importance on a cosmic level, you are absolutely right! This is why it is so important to see that many humans who have done this have committed unspeakable atrocities, sometimes in their own name and sometimes, tragically, in the name of their god. But the Bible clearly communicates that humans are fallen and yet valued by God who gave His Son Jesus to redeem them.

What does that say about how God values me and every other person on earth? I have to conclude that I have value because the one who made me also loves me so much that He is willing to die to demonstrate my value to Him and bring me back into a relationship with Him. The Bible tells us “But God demonstrates His love to us in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.” (Romans 5) The value that God places on us is real (demonstrated in Christ) and it is permanent (because He maintains that value, not me, not my circumstances, not my relationships). The amazing thing is that my value remains unchanged whether or not I accept it, ignore it or even spit on it. True value can only be assigned by the Creator and not by the creation. Anything else is worthless.

Purpose with this perspective is a massive and unmoving mountain before us “Love the Lord your God with all your heart and all your mind and all your strength”. This joins what we know about God with a heart of thankfulness and joy and hands that serve those around us with courage, compassion and sacrifice.

Final questions:

Am I willing to love God above everything else, even my own safety, comfort, reputation, security or future? Is this purpose the central expression of both the Old and the New Testament? Is it a true reflection of God's desires for us and command to us? How do we know that for sure? How do my daily activities and conversations reflect this grand purpose? Is this even possible without a deep shift in my character and the desires of my heart as well as how I filter and process ideas? How can I learn to love God more completely, hate what He hates and love what He loves?